NIAGARA MEANS THE NECK

 Very interesting considering what things are called in the Book of Mormon:

THE WHOLE GAY MELEE AND THE CHURCH IN A DELICATE POSITION

 So, I have an acquaintance from growing up who is very gay-friendly (politically correct/fly the rainbow flag in support kind of guy who supports anyone, regardless of where they put their Pecker).  Here were a few excerpts from a friendly, but mildly warm exchange.  He is always gentle in his approach, so I reserve the right to return on generally the same level in my muted responses:

• • I know where you are coming from, but I will have to respectfully state God’s position, which is to lovingly encourage anyone including our own children to fight the battle against sin, and to not give in to temptation.

    I will tell you of my own battle; since about 11 years old, I had an overwhelming desire to break the law of chastity, first with beautiful young ladies. Even after marrying, there have been many temptations for me with women single and married. There were many times I could have caved, but I chose to use resolve and overcome my natural-born tendencies. I prevailed and determined that, even though I had these overwhelming urges and attractions, I could keep my will within the bounds the Lord had set and bend my will towards His. It is my gift to Him and the only thing I can offer in my broken and fallen state.

    Not once did my parents tell me I should just cave in to my urges. In fact, they gave me a good example to live by and many times, that is all I had to lean on in the face of temptation. I encourage you to do the same. Do not coddle or enable. It is the only thing you can pass on to your posterity, just as your father did to you and successive generations.
  • Mr Wood Zone:  Mr Gay Friendly,

     the most loving thing you can do is to lovingly and firmly encourage children to hold to the rod or word of God. Being permissive gives them carte blanche to destroy their lives. Eternal lives, to be exact. I caveat that with those who are hermaphrodites. A whole different ball of wax....
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  • Mr Gay Friendly;

    That really depends on what that looks like. Some people teach "tough love" and banish a child from their home. Many of those teens take their own lives because of the shame the feel, or the lack of acceptance. Child Trafficking and Pedophilia do not belong in this conversation.
  • And believe it or not the Church itself has lowered the bar. 40 plus years ago the church published a manual or pamphlet claiming masturbation caused homosexuality. The church now basically concedes that you are born homosexual. Nobody would choose a life as a minority group that gets persecuted. Check LDS.org you'll find a section on same sex attraction that may surprise you. Two of the Q of the twelve have either a child or a brother that are gay. In fact spoken of two weeks ago. Straight or gay the love of God is the same.

    
    
  • It is still my belief that one should obviously hold the line on something, but still love the person. Let me ask you this; should you still love the person if said person is living in your basement and bringing his gay lover over and doing sinful things in the house; going against house rules. Can your home truly be a temple if someone is committing heinous acts (in clear defiance of God's command to multiply and replenish the earth). If so, where do you draw the line? I remember a member of the Stake Presidency who tossed a teen that had taken the virginity of a key person in his very home. NOT smart on that kid to do so. Disrespectful at the least. I think you have to clearly state the line and stick to it. Otherwise, you have chaos. What about if your kid is out of control and screaming obscenities at their mother? Where is the line? It is an interesting topic for sure.

    
    
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  • Mr Gay Friendly:  Mr Wood Zone, I think we agree on most everything. As far as a kid of mine taking a “date” downstairs, boy or girl that would be in defiance of our rules. Almost every man (and maybe not as many woman) struggle with opposite sex attraction. Before and/or after marriage. Couple that with the epidemic that is pornography and I feel for the young people who grow up viewing unhealthy and impossible ideas of what sex should be. Member of the church, or any church are not exempt from that. In fact, maybe even more drawn to the forbidden fruit. I’ve read that Utah is the highest or close to porn usage. If left to flourish, and it will be, it will and has ruined many lives. I’ve served in Bishoprics and that is by far the biggest problem. Boy I got off on a tangent. Let me just simply say, my goal of which I fall short is to love everyone. It doesn’t mean I condone whatever it is they’re doing. I have a small group of friends and or acquaintances that are gay. They are all people anybody would want as friends. I’ll leave names out, but you surely know some of them.

    Mr Wood Zone:  Gay Friendly, yes, so hard. My wife has forgiven her abuser. Love the sinner, hate the sin. I have MAJOR heart burn with “celebrating” anything to do with anything that flies in the face of sin that stifles life or hinders the creation of it. I always crudely say, “Conception has never occurred in the anus”. It is a victory of the devil himself to see people desecrate their bodies such that procreation within the bonds of loving marriage cannot occur. He will never get a body, so he has focused on destroying life thru abortion, excessive birth control, same sex attraction and sexual acts, and so much more. Satan delights in anything that sticks a finger in God’s eye or mocks the Atonement.
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  • Gay Friendly:  Love should never be withdrawn when a child, friend or family member fails to live up to your expectations.

    I simply asked Eric if that would include if they were gay? He basically said no. So why the meme? People are born gay. They don’t just wake up one day and decide. They don’t “become” gay because of abuse. They don’t turn guy because of masturbation, yes that was taught. Some people choose not to act upon it, just like straight people may chose not to act upon their carnal instincts before marriage. Both of those people can attend the Temple, even if they identify as gay.

    So let me ask you this, does God love straight people more than gay people? No he doesn’t. So she we love everyone equally.

    Almost all child molesters identify as straight. That is flat out evil and should end up behind bars for life.

    Eric said to lovingly but firmly encourage them. A couple of months ago you used a homophobic slur to an ex Bishop who had a gay daughter. How could someone do that? Especially knowing her father was actively participating in the post. So,if that’s what lovingly and firmly looks like it’s going to continue to drive them to suicide.

    Just love people and leave the judgment to God.

    As you can tell I’m pretty passionate when it comes to how my gay brothers and sisters are treated.
  • Gay Friendly; Given that reality, the website Mormon and Gay launched last year to help gay Mormons openly discuss maintaining their faith without practicing their sexuality.

    The website is owned by the church and is the first time the church acknowledged that people do not choose to be gay. Still, it is unclear how many people are aware of the website or its teachings.
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    Gay Friendly, who is an ex-Bishop who has a gay daughter? I am not aware of it. I have no problem with gay people. UNLESS they are militantly gay and want to shove their agenda down the throat of those who don't want that part of society gaining anymore traction. I will never fly a rainbow flag in front of my house. I do not support it, no more than I would a person who flaunts what they do behind closed doors who is a heterosexual.... They brought the fight to the Christians by doing a full-court press and even persecuting those who choose Biblical definitions of marriage. The typical stance is: Support us, or you are socially ill. I say the opposite. I say move to the correct side of the equation, which is: repent and live. There is a reason drug use and suicide is so high among those who are gay. The lifestyle is self-destructive (generally-speaking). The numbers prove it. If I truly loved my child or another child of God who might be struggling with those feelings would be to move them to a demographic where their chances at successful life would be increased, not where the average age of death is 58 for males. I also know many who have gone there - and it has destroyed very healthy and loving families. The man had multiple different gay lovers (strangers) that he would meet at the bath houses in Seattle in the late 80's. Well, his poor daughter had to nurse him on his death bed because he died a terrible death due to his poor choices - all while his daughters and wife were in the poor house. All so he could carry on his hedonistic choices. NOT good.... The merciful thing, is to stick to the traditional guns, all while having loving arms open and ready to receive the repentant. This is what is tearing America apart. It is not the traditional values, it is the people who have descended into the neuspeak and moral relativism. It will cost many their standing before God, as they were not valiant in the testimony of Jesus - who would have said, "Go and SIN NO MORE.".

    • • Mr Wood Zone:  Rainbow Friend, I would be horrified if someone mistreated someone JUST because they were gay. I would condemn that as much as I would those would mistreat a Christian who believes in traditional marriage. I have had multiple gay bosses at Boeing. I have hugged and wept in the arms of my favorite male manager (gay) after losing my son to SIDS and then my mother six months later. He was an exceptional man and in a committed and loving monogamous relationship with another man. Though I do not agree with his choices, he at least was not being an alley cat with the other gay men at bath houses, etc That, I have ZERO stomach for.... How disgusting! How self-destructive! I am every bit as disgusted by that as I would be with a guy who hung out with the mangiest of prostitutes on skid row. As a committed germ freak, that is beyond disgusting!! GROSS!! 
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        It is the militants that want to force me to bend my (God's) will towards their agenda, which flies in the face of Christianity. If the Church moves that direction, it will be destroyed, along with every other Babylonian construct and 3 Nephi 20 will be in effect. Ephraim will lose her right to preside (other than a possible symbolic role) and it will be given to Manasseh to bring in the New Jerusalem in a meaningful way. Mrs Wood Zone showed me a survey on this very topic just this morning that was disturbing. Continue down that path and SLC will be destroyed in a significant way along with all those who support that position. Let it be so! If it must be. If you need further info on the topic, read VoG. We are at a crossroads as a people, as a nation and as individuals. The West Coast will fare no better. Take down the rainbow flags and get down to the business of repentance. This is not judgment, this is good and timely counsel. The only thing I have no keys to is final judgment. Judgment has already been given in the scriptures and it is a no-brainer (if they are actually read).
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