I got the following comment to an earlier piece on drought in the SW:
I am surprised that you are taking Bishop Koyle statement over a living prophet. Did you know that he was excommunicated for teaching false doctrine by taking over the mantle of the prophet? This is why I am surprised that put this in here stating he was indeed a prophet which he is not.
That is a fair comment, if you do not have the actual history on the man. Bishop Koyle had more prophetic bent in him and he exercised that gift more than any other person since Joseph Smith, possibly other than Brigham's, "the prophet to the Prophet", Heber C. Kimball.
God would have it that we all have the gift of prophecy and were all exercising that gift, which is the testimony of Jesus. It is through this gift that we know who was the Savior of the World.
The thing that got Koyle into trouble was the same thing that has gotten everyone else into trouble who has stepped out; and that is that he got a following and then kind of nurtured it along and did not tone it down. He also was so prophetic that he embarrassed several people who should have gotten some prophetic calls right, but he did not. The only time that gift becomes a problem is when people go off the rails and set themselves up for a light and do the priestcraft thing (trying to make money, etc).
So, yes he was ex-commied. But was reinstated after this particular "Prophet" was out of the scene and allegedly came back to tell his successor that he had screwed up and could not progress until he had set things straight. This is how it works over there. Everyone is ranked. If you fling poo or piss upon another of higher rank, you must go through them to keep progressing. This means repentance by the offender. This is why I would rather give someone the bennie of the doubt, instead of flapping my tongue (which I am prone to do) and suffer the physical/spiritual/emotional consequences in this life and the lack of progression in the next. Actually - damned in both spheres of existence. God is patient - to a point - but when we step in it a little too hard, the hammer drops - and it can be breathtaking to witness.
So yes - second or third ranked in this dispensation! With Joseph as top dog. That is how the cookie crumbles and I do not apologize for it.
that part you said about him coming back is true but he set up the mine which is still there and he never gave up that mine which he prophesied that would help the church in the future which I know is not true. In Amos 3:7 says that the Lord will reveal nothing except to his servant the Prophet and this is why I have problems with this topics. Denver Snuffer has came out thinking he is the prophet, Julie Rowe thinks she is one also and there are others like that too.
ReplyDeleteThe scripture does not say that "He will reveal nothing except to his servant the Prophet", it says "Surely the Lord will do nothing, but he revealeth his secret unto his servants the prophets." Those are two very different statements. The way it is actually written promises that before doing anything, the Lord will warn the prophets (notice prophets, plural. Does this include both Prophets, with a big P, and prophets, with a little p?) The scripture says that the Lord will warn the prophets, but doesn't preclude him from warning others as well. It never says he tells ONLY the prophets.
DeleteMore about Bishop Koyle can be learned at ReliefMine.com
ReplyDeleteYou should add this post to yours. I have studied Bishop Koyle inside out. Hand down he is the most prophetic man ( bested only By Joseph Smith and Heber C Kimball ). He did not usurp anything or anyone. Most Dont know Koyle had his calling and election made sure and also received his second anointing's received in the SLC temple under the prophet..... Most also dont know there were members of the first presidency who supported him and more apostles believe he was called of God then those who opposed him. I could go in more detail on this but wont. He got exed ultimately because the church bullied him into signing a statement he should not have. He was warned to never sign anything. His mission is legit, it is of God and it is sad he had a falling out with some of the brethren that lead to his eventually being exed. One very interesting note. Those who were apostles who defended him and supported him said they did so because it was reveled by God that his work was of God. Those who fought against him admitted it was because of opinion and not because of revelation. Those who fell into this category were Joseph F Smith & Elder Talmage. Which is a little surprising but true. But that being said atleast they had enough integrity to admit it was a matter of opinion and not revelation. but most would be surprised many of the brethren loved him and knew his mission was of god. Sad how it ended for him. But according to one statement by Koyle after Talmage died he camed to Koyle and begged his forgiveness and was not allowed to progress until he gave it to him. Which Koyle freely forgave him...... Koyle mission is really and te mine will probably come in in next year or so..... Get your silver and gold folks!
ReplyDeleteFunny how current leaders are engaging in priestcraft. Also sad that ideas are an excommunicable offense but pedophilia is not, nor rape, nor abortion. But hey, everyone prospers in zion.
ReplyDeleteAs far as much as I have read, Koyle was Xed based on hear say and not by any sort of one on one investigation. It came down from the top to X him. The top never wanted to have an interview with him; as he had tried to seek an interview with them for many years.
ReplyDeleteKoyle has been faithful and respectful to the leadership of the church no matter how much abuse they heaped upon them. He did not appear bitter but beaten down near the end of his life. Same as Joseph S. was pretty beaten down near the end as well. If you are going to be a prophet, it can be a very hard row to hoe.
I think his prophetic abilities got him in trouble, he embarrassed the leadership. I don't see any evidence that presidents of the church since Joseph, are not the same as Joseph in prophetic gift. I am still assessing what I see, but you can receive the anointing but it doesn't mean you have the same kind of gift of revelation and prophecy as Joseph, but act by inspiration as much as your bishop or stake president. I think that a persons prejudices and belief system can reject those slight little inclinations and warnings. If a person willfully follows his own inclinations that is free agency.
"Everyone is ranked. If you fling poo or piss upon another of higher rank, you must go through them to keep progressing."
ReplyDeleteThis is one of the more interesting comments you have made.
Here's something most don't understand: One's position in this life does not necessarily reflect their position in pre-mortality. There are many great spirits that have assumed very humble situations in this world. Many like to think the greatest spirits constitute the leadership of the Mormon church. That just ain't so. People have different things to work on, and leading a church isn't always part of the equation for some great ones. Abraham was one of these, and he spent most of his life as a wandering herdsman.
There are going to be a lot of people owing some big apologies to these people when all is said and done. That's why the Golden Rule exists: if you treat other people as you'd like to be treated, you'll never find yourself in that unfortunate situation.