It does not get more succinct than this:
Many
members have said that we need a prophet like Ezra Taft Benson right
now, but history has proven (and are we ever going to truly learn from
it?) that we have the prophet we are meant to have at the time we are
meant to have him and that suggesting otherwise is unwise and a
precursor to apostasy.
Sometimes, concerning certain topics, the prophets mouths are shut or opened less because of people's choices. While food storage used to be a hot topic, (seven years of food, then twelve, and now three months...) we don't hear about it as often because we are much more of a global church now (making it difficult for those outside of the USA). Surveys show the majority of members aren't listening anyway, which is one of the reasons why the amount of food storage suggested has lessened over the years.
The Samuel principle teaches us that our choices determine much of what we are able and willing to receive, and that agency is something Father values oftentimes to the detriment of individual lives, societies, and even entire civilizations.
"And now I, Nephi, cannot say more; the Spirit stoppeth mine utterance, and I am left to mourn because of the unbelief, and the wickedness, and the ignorance, and the stiffneckedness of men; for they will not search knowledge, nor understand great knowledge, when it is given unto them in plainness, even as plain as word can be." (2 Nephi 32:7)
“Some people say I am a fallen Prophet, because I do not bring forth more of the word of the Lord, Why do I not do it? Are we able to receive it? No! Not one in this room. He then chastened the congregation for their wickedness and unbelief..." (TPJS 194)
"And therefore, he that will harden his heart, the same receiveth the lesser portion of the word; and he that will not harden his heart, to him is given the greater portion of the word, until it is given unto him to know the mysteries of God until he know them in full." (Alma 12:10)
"Murmur not because of the things which thou hast not seen, for they are withheld from thee and from the world, which is wisdom in me in a time to come." (D&C 25:4)
"God hath not revealed anything to Joseph, but what he will make known to the Twelve, and even the least saint may know all things as fast as he is able to bear them."
(Joseph Smith, Instructions to the brethren at a conference of the Twelve, June 27, 1839 in Commerce, Ill. HC 3:380.)
"You need exhorting rather than teaching. You have been taught doctrine in abundance, and I have sometimes thought it a pity the Lord has revealed quite as much as he has. And I can truly say that I believe, if I am guilty in any one point in my walk before this people, it is in telling them things they are not worthy of—that I have given unto them things that they could not receive. For this reason I deem it mainly needful to stir up your pure minds by way of remembrance. 2 Pet. 3:1" (JD 7:237 Brigham Young)
“God has to work through mortals of varying degrees of spiritual progress. Sometimes he temporarily grants to men their unwise requests in order that they might learn from their own sad experiences. Some refer to this as the ‘Samuel Principle.’ This children of Israel wanted a king, like all the nations. … The Lord told Samuel to warn the people of the consequences if they had a king. Samuel gave them the warning, but they still insisted on their king. So God gave them a king and let them suffer. … God wanted it to be otherwise, but within certain bounds he grants unto men according to their desires. Bad experiences are an expensive school that only fools keep going to. …" (Ezra Taft Benson, BYU Speeches of the Year, Provo, Utah: Brigham Young Univ. Press, 1974, pp. 304–5.)
"And it shall come to pass that the righteous shall be gathered out from among all nations, and shall come to Zion, singing with songs of everlasting joy.
And now I say unto you, keep these things from going abroad unto the world until it is expedient in me, that ye may accomplish this work in the eyes of the people, and in the eyes of your enemies, that they may not know your works until ye have accomplished the thing which I have commanded you..." (D&C 45:71)
The Samuel principle teaches us that our choices determine much of what we are able and willing to receive, and that agency is something Father values oftentimes to the detriment of individual lives, societies, and even entire civilizations.
"And now I, Nephi, cannot say more; the Spirit stoppeth mine utterance, and I am left to mourn because of the unbelief, and the wickedness, and the ignorance, and the stiffneckedness of men; for they will not search knowledge, nor understand great knowledge, when it is given unto them in plainness, even as plain as word can be." (2 Nephi 32:7)
“Some people say I am a fallen Prophet, because I do not bring forth more of the word of the Lord, Why do I not do it? Are we able to receive it? No! Not one in this room. He then chastened the congregation for their wickedness and unbelief..." (TPJS 194)
"And therefore, he that will harden his heart, the same receiveth the lesser portion of the word; and he that will not harden his heart, to him is given the greater portion of the word, until it is given unto him to know the mysteries of God until he know them in full." (Alma 12:10)
"Murmur not because of the things which thou hast not seen, for they are withheld from thee and from the world, which is wisdom in me in a time to come." (D&C 25:4)
"God hath not revealed anything to Joseph, but what he will make known to the Twelve, and even the least saint may know all things as fast as he is able to bear them."
(Joseph Smith, Instructions to the brethren at a conference of the Twelve, June 27, 1839 in Commerce, Ill. HC 3:380.)
"You need exhorting rather than teaching. You have been taught doctrine in abundance, and I have sometimes thought it a pity the Lord has revealed quite as much as he has. And I can truly say that I believe, if I am guilty in any one point in my walk before this people, it is in telling them things they are not worthy of—that I have given unto them things that they could not receive. For this reason I deem it mainly needful to stir up your pure minds by way of remembrance. 2 Pet. 3:1" (JD 7:237 Brigham Young)
“God has to work through mortals of varying degrees of spiritual progress. Sometimes he temporarily grants to men their unwise requests in order that they might learn from their own sad experiences. Some refer to this as the ‘Samuel Principle.’ This children of Israel wanted a king, like all the nations. … The Lord told Samuel to warn the people of the consequences if they had a king. Samuel gave them the warning, but they still insisted on their king. So God gave them a king and let them suffer. … God wanted it to be otherwise, but within certain bounds he grants unto men according to their desires. Bad experiences are an expensive school that only fools keep going to. …" (Ezra Taft Benson, BYU Speeches of the Year, Provo, Utah: Brigham Young Univ. Press, 1974, pp. 304–5.)
"And it shall come to pass that the righteous shall be gathered out from among all nations, and shall come to Zion, singing with songs of everlasting joy.
And now I say unto you, keep these things from going abroad unto the world until it is expedient in me, that ye may accomplish this work in the eyes of the people, and in the eyes of your enemies, that they may not know your works until ye have accomplished the thing which I have commanded you..." (D&C 45:71)
"I perceive that ye are weak, that ye cannot understand all my words which I am commanded of the Father to speak unto you at this time." (3 Nephi 17:2)
Sometimes, concerning certain topics, the prophets mouths are shut or opened less because of people's choices. While food storage used to be a hot topic, (seven years of food, then twelve, and now three months...) we don't hear about it as often because we are much more of a global church now (making it difficult for those outside of the USA). Surveys show the majority of members aren't listening anyway, which is one of the reasons why the amount of food storage suggested has lessened over the years.
The Samuel principle teaches us that our choices determine much of what we are able and willing to receive, and that agency is something Father values oftentimes to the detriment of individual lives, societies, and even entire civilizations.
"And now I, Nephi, cannot say more; the Spirit stoppeth mine utterance, and I am left to mourn because of the unbelief, and the wickedness, and the ignorance, and the stiffneckedness of men; for they will not search knowledge, nor understand great knowledge, when it is given unto them in plainness, even as plain as word can be." (2 Nephi 32:7)
“Some people say I am a fallen Prophet, because I do not bring forth more of the word of the Lord, Why do I not do it? Are we able to receive it? No! Not one in this room. He then chastened the congregation for their wickedness and unbelief..." (TPJS 194)
"And therefore, he that will harden his heart, the same receiveth the lesser portion of the word; and he that will not harden his heart, to him is given the greater portion of the word, until it is given unto him to know the mysteries of God until he know them in full." (Alma 12:10)
"Murmur not because of the things which thou hast not seen, for they are withheld from thee and from the world, which is wisdom in me in a time to come." (D&C 25:4)
"God hath not revealed anything to Joseph, but what he will make known to the Twelve, and even the least saint may know all things as fast as he is able to bear them."
(Joseph Smith, Instructions to the brethren at a conference of the Twelve, June 27, 1839 in Commerce, Ill. HC 3:380.)
"You need exhorting rather than teaching. You have been taught doctrine in abundance, and I have sometimes thought it a pity the Lord has revealed quite as much as he has. And I can truly say that I believe, if I am guilty in any one point in my walk before this people, it is in telling them things they are not worthy of—that I have given unto them things that they could not receive. For this reason I deem it mainly needful to stir up your pure minds by way of remembrance. 2 Pet. 3:1" (JD 7:237 Brigham Young)
“God has to work through mortals of varying degrees of spiritual progress. Sometimes he temporarily grants to men their unwise requests in order that they might learn from their own sad experiences. Some refer to this as the ‘Samuel Principle.’ This children of Israel wanted a king, like all the nations. … The Lord told Samuel to warn the people of the consequences if they had a king. Samuel gave them the warning, but they still insisted on their king. So God gave them a king and let them suffer. … God wanted it to be otherwise, but within certain bounds he grants unto men according to their desires. Bad experiences are an expensive school that only fools keep going to. …" (Ezra Taft Benson, BYU Speeches of the Year, Provo, Utah: Brigham Young Univ. Press, 1974, pp. 304–5.)
"And it shall come to pass that the righteous shall be gathered out from among all nations, and shall come to Zion, singing with songs of everlasting joy.
And now I say unto you, keep these things from going abroad unto the world until it is expedient in me, that ye may accomplish this work in the eyes of the people, and in the eyes of your enemies, that they may not know your works until ye have accomplished the thing which I have commanded you..." (D&C 45:71)
The Samuel principle teaches us that our choices determine much of what we are able and willing to receive, and that agency is something Father values oftentimes to the detriment of individual lives, societies, and even entire civilizations.
"And now I, Nephi, cannot say more; the Spirit stoppeth mine utterance, and I am left to mourn because of the unbelief, and the wickedness, and the ignorance, and the stiffneckedness of men; for they will not search knowledge, nor understand great knowledge, when it is given unto them in plainness, even as plain as word can be." (2 Nephi 32:7)
“Some people say I am a fallen Prophet, because I do not bring forth more of the word of the Lord, Why do I not do it? Are we able to receive it? No! Not one in this room. He then chastened the congregation for their wickedness and unbelief..." (TPJS 194)
"And therefore, he that will harden his heart, the same receiveth the lesser portion of the word; and he that will not harden his heart, to him is given the greater portion of the word, until it is given unto him to know the mysteries of God until he know them in full." (Alma 12:10)
"Murmur not because of the things which thou hast not seen, for they are withheld from thee and from the world, which is wisdom in me in a time to come." (D&C 25:4)
"God hath not revealed anything to Joseph, but what he will make known to the Twelve, and even the least saint may know all things as fast as he is able to bear them."
(Joseph Smith, Instructions to the brethren at a conference of the Twelve, June 27, 1839 in Commerce, Ill. HC 3:380.)
"You need exhorting rather than teaching. You have been taught doctrine in abundance, and I have sometimes thought it a pity the Lord has revealed quite as much as he has. And I can truly say that I believe, if I am guilty in any one point in my walk before this people, it is in telling them things they are not worthy of—that I have given unto them things that they could not receive. For this reason I deem it mainly needful to stir up your pure minds by way of remembrance. 2 Pet. 3:1" (JD 7:237 Brigham Young)
“God has to work through mortals of varying degrees of spiritual progress. Sometimes he temporarily grants to men their unwise requests in order that they might learn from their own sad experiences. Some refer to this as the ‘Samuel Principle.’ This children of Israel wanted a king, like all the nations. … The Lord told Samuel to warn the people of the consequences if they had a king. Samuel gave them the warning, but they still insisted on their king. So God gave them a king and let them suffer. … God wanted it to be otherwise, but within certain bounds he grants unto men according to their desires. Bad experiences are an expensive school that only fools keep going to. …" (Ezra Taft Benson, BYU Speeches of the Year, Provo, Utah: Brigham Young Univ. Press, 1974, pp. 304–5.)
"And it shall come to pass that the righteous shall be gathered out from among all nations, and shall come to Zion, singing with songs of everlasting joy.
And now I say unto you, keep these things from going abroad unto the world until it is expedient in me, that ye may accomplish this work in the eyes of the people, and in the eyes of your enemies, that they may not know your works until ye have accomplished the thing which I have commanded you..." (D&C 45:71)
"I perceive that ye are weak, that ye cannot understand all my words which I am commanded of the Father to speak unto you at this time." (3 Nephi 17:2)
This is a Samuel principle parable for a membership largely refusing to understand our awful situation, too distracted to care, and, from what I have personally observed, unable or unwilling to handle it. The Lord's servants will often speak in parables or veiled warnings just as Jesus did before he was crucified. The patterns are the same.
Pres. Monson's chicken parable was specifically before he spoke about being prepared... being prepared for what? Read more here:
Are We Prepared? - Ensign September 2014 - ensign
https://www.lds.org/ensign/2014/09/are-we-prepared?lang=eng
“There has been a great difficulty in getting anything into the heads of this generation. It has been like splitting hemlock knots with a corn-dodger [a piece of corn bread] for a wedge, and a pumpkin for a beetle [a wooden mallet]. Even the Saints are slow to understand.
“I have tried for a number of years to get the minds of the Saints prepared to receive the things of God; but we frequently see some of them, after suffering all they have for the work of God, will fly to pieces like glass as soon as anything comes that is contrary to their traditions: they cannot stand the fire at all. How many will be able to abide a celestial law, and go through and receive their exaltation, I am unable to say, as many are called, but few are chosen [see D&C 121:40].”
"You are welcome to all the knowledge and intelligence I can impart to you. Some people say I am a fallen Prophet, because I do not bring forth more of the word of the Lord. Why do I not do it? Are we able to receive it? No! not one in this room.”
“The Saints need not think because I am familiar with them and am playful and cheerful, that I am ignorant of what is going on."
Teachings of Presidents of the Church: Joseph Smith, (2011), 517–27
https://www.lds.org/manu…/teachings-joseph-smith/chapter-45…
Joseph Smith couldn't have said it better than what's in the chicken picture. Foolish Traditions. Lambs were born in the Spring and watched over by the shepherds at night. NEVER in the winter. December 25th. The birth of baby Tamuz mingled with celebrating the birth of the Son of God. Easter/Astare, the goddess of fertility, mingled with the Resurrection of the Son of God. Halloween, devil's holiday. LDS children dress up as witches, ghosts, super heroes, cats, you name it, carve jack o' lanterns that have demonic origins, YET you call it out and totally shut down.
ReplyDelete"We've always done it this way and we're NOT going to stop celebrating these holidays that distract from the TRUE ones God told us to observe. We'll go in to needless debt, get trampled at Walmart, dye eggs that used to be dyed in infants' blood, and carve out jack o' lanterns that invite demonic spirits into our homes. Fooey on you!"
FOOLISH people! We might well ask WHERE are the Samuel the Lamanites so desperately needed or the Nephi's praying from his garden tower? They're to busy gazing at the newest xbox games behind a glass door at Walmart along with the small tykes.
TRUTH has been told this day and yet it will be dismissed. God is MORE, WAY MORE, than any of us can imagine or comprehend. MANY are going to come to the ice water in the face realization that they're not as righteous as they think.
HE IS GOD and you will not force your beliefs and traditions on HIM! You WILL endure sound doctrine and HIS WAY or you will be destroyed.
Our leaders know these things and still entertain the followers in the PAGAN names of Christmas and Easter. Now let's talk statues large and small.
Yeah, the truth is just to much for some people. Those warned bury the truth. To controversial. No backbone to tell it like it is.
I fear no man. I fear and serve the living God only.
You know you probably won't post this comment but truth is sometimes a bit hard to swallow and most members just don't want to see it.
ReplyDeleteI totally agree with the title of this post :
"THE SAINTS CANNOT ENDURE SOUND DOCTRINE"
mostly because we don't read our scriptures.
A well known LDS writer once wrote a
foreword in a book and said -
"This book might well be entitled
"What you always wanted to know about the Gospel
but were too lazy to find out."
"All answers are in the scriptures,but Latter-day Saints
do not read the scriptures."
Hugh Nibley
READ OUR SCRIPTURES !
All the answers are contained in them.
You know you're right.
you said quote:
"history has proven (and are we ever going to truly learn from it?) that we have the prophet we are meant to have at the time we are meant to have him "
"and that suggesting otherwise is unwise and a precursor to apostasy."
which is what we're in. APOSTASY.
The reason why we have not received more of the word of the Lord is not just because of the members but because the church is in APOSTASY as well.
I could post pages of scriptures showing this. (not just my opinion but scriptures)
The Lord has tried to warn and tell us - but we just DON"T WANT TO SEE IT !
we do as it says below
"People say…"
“People say they love truth, but in reality they want to believe that which they love is true.” –Robert J. Ringer
and I might add - lean to "the precept of men" and as Nephi said:
2 Nephi 28:21,24,25
21 And others will he pacify,
and lull them away into carnal security,
that they will say: All is well in Zion;
yea, Zion prospereth, all is well—
and thus the devil cheateth their souls,
and leadeth them away carefully down to hell.
24 Therefore, wo be unto him that is at ease in Zion!
25 Wo be unto him that crieth: All is well!
WHEN we members stop thinking we are ALWAYS in the right
and can do no wrong, and start heeding the warnings that are in Isaiah and
the Book of Mormon for us, maybe than, and ONLY then
will the Lord lift the condemnation that we have been under for so many years and come to the truth and be saved from the tribulations that are coming upon us.
D&C 84:
57 And they shall remain under this condemnation
until they repent and remember the new covenant,
even the Book of Mormon and the former
commandments which I have given them,
not only to say, but to do according to
that which I have written—
WHY DID THE LORD HIMSELF SAY
"for great are the words of Isaiah" and
gave us a commandment that we search them diligently.
Because they are speaking about us -
the (Gentiles - especially the church today)
3 Nephi 23:1- 4
1 "And now, behold, I say unto you,
that ye ought to search these things.
Yea, a commandment I give unto
you that ye search these things diligently;
for great are the words of Isaiah."
2 "For surely he spake as touching all things
concerning my people which are of the house of Israel;
therefore it must needs be that he must speak
also to the Gentiles."
( Gentiles are us, members, and all of us here today in the U.S. )
3 "And all things that he spake (have been and shall be),
even according to the words which he spake."
4 "Therefore give heed to my words;
write the things which I have told you;
and according to the time and the will
of the Father they shall go forth unto the Gentiles."
3 Nephi 20:11
11 "Ye remember that I spake unto you,
and said that when the words of Isaiah
should be fulfilled—behold they are written,
ye have them before you, therefore search them."
continued
ReplyDeleteIsaiah has now been unsealed and brought
to light by the Lord for our understanding in these last days.
Isaiah 44:7
7 "Who predicts what happens as do I, and is the equal of me in appointing a people from of old as types, foretelling things to come?
Isaiah uses what are called types from the past
to show the future.
What has happened before, will happen again.
ALL THE PROPHECIES OF ISAIAH PERTAIN TO US TODAY
All prophecies in Isaiah are prophecies of the last days.
Referring to our church and the sad condition we are in,
Isaiah begins his book speaking to us,
Ephraim, or the church today.
Isaiah 1:2-5
Description of modern Ephraim
(addressing our church he calls Israel)
2 Hear, O heavens! Give heed, O earth!
Jehovah has spoken:I have reared sons,
brought them up,but they have revolted against me.
3 The ox knows its owner,the donkey its master’s stall,
but Israel does not know;my people are insensible.
4 Alas, a nation astray,a people weighed down by sin,
the offspring of wrongdoers,perverse children:
they have forsaken Jehovah,they have spurned
the Holy One of Israel,they have lapsed into APOSTASY.
------------------------------------------------------------
Isaiah 24:5
5 "The earth lies polluted under its inhabitants:
they have transgressed the laws,
changed the ordinances, set at nought the ancient covenant."
explanation:
"Causing these curses is the wickedness of Jehovah’s people, who have altered his “ordinances” or “ritual” and perverted his “laws” or “doctrine” , thereby violating Jehovah’s covenant and rendering it void. Jehovah’s servant, who personifies Jehovah’s covenant (Isaiah 42:6; 49:8), they likewise set at nought (Isaiah 49:7; 50:5-11; 52:14)."
Isaiah 29:9,10 13,14
9 Stay yourselves, and wonder; cry ye out, and cry: they are drunken, but not with wine; they stagger, but not with strong drink.
10 For the Lord hath poured out upon you the spirit of deep sleep, and hath closed your eyes: the prophets and your rulers, the seers hath he covered.
13 Wherefore the Lord said, Forasmuch as this people draw near me with their mouth, and with their lips do honour me, but have removed their heart far from me, and their fear toward me is taught by the precept of men:
14 Therefore, behold, I will proceed to do a marvellous work among this people, even a marvellous work and a wonder: for the wisdom of their wise men shall perish, and the understanding of their prudent men shall be hid.
-----------------------------------------------------------
Isaiah 9:2 the people "walking in darkness"
(without revelation) refers to the church today.
"Land of the shadow of death" is the U.S.
after the invasion by the beast.
9:2 The people that walked in darkness have seen a great light: they that dwell in the land of the shadow of death,
upon them hath the light shined.
There are only two possibilities. Either you do not understand Isaiah or you are deliberately trying to lead people astray. You claim that Isaiah is saying that the church today is in apostasy, which is totally false. While I would agree that we all need to repent and more fully follow our Savior that is totally different than saying that the church as a whole is in apostasy. Isaiah in your quoted verses was talking to ancient Israel, not the restored Church of Jesus Christ. Daniel saw a vision of our day where he described a stone being cut out of a mountain without hands and it destroyed the terrible image seen by the king and then it filled the whole earth. (See Daniel 2:44-45) That stone represents the church and kingdom of God which has come forth in these latter days. The Church of Jesus Christ of Latter Day Saints is the church and kingdom of God prophesied by Daniel and it will never be destroyed or left to other people. (Or fall into apostasy)
DeleteYou also claim that Isaiah is saying that the church today is "walking in darkness" (without revelation). If you claim this then you deny that the church today is led by a prophet of God who leads this church by revelation from the Lord. If this is your claim then it is you who are in apostasy and you need to repent before it is too late for you.
Quentin L. Cook made the following comment about following the prophet in the 2008 April Conference session:
In Doctrine and Covenants, section 21, speaking specifically of the prophet, the Lord declares:
“Thou shalt give heed unto all his words and commandments which he shall give unto you as he receiveth them, walking in all holiness before me;
“For his word ye shall receive, as if from mine own mouth, in all patience and faith.”
You have said many things to criticize the children of Ephraim, and while it is true that the Lord will chasten his people, yet there are many great things promised to the children of Ephraim if they live worthily. Doctrine and Covenants 133: 30-34
30 And they shall bring forth their rich treasures unto the children of Ephraim, my servants.
31 And the boundaries of the everlasting hills shall tremble at their presence.
32 And there shall they fall down and be crowned with glory, even in Zion, by the hands of the servants of the Lord, even the children of Ephraim.
33 And they shall be filled with songs of everlasting joy.
34 Behold, this is the blessing of the everlasting God upon the tribes of Israel, and the richer blessing upon the head of Ephraim and his fellows.
I testify that the Church of Jesus Christ of Latter Day Saints is the true church of Christ and is the Church and Kingdom of God on the earth today. I testify that the Church today is lead by a prophet of God who leads the Church by revelation from the Lord. In the name of Jesus Christ, Amen.
WAKE UP my friend.
Delete2 Nephi 1:13
13 "O that ye would awake; awake from a deep sleep, yea, even from the sleep of hell,
and shake off the awful chains by which ye are bound, which are the chains which bind
the children of men, that they are carried away captive down to the eternal gulf of misery and woe."
As I have stated before
Isaiah uses what are called types from the past
to show the future.
What has happened before, will happen again.
ALL THE PROPHECIES OF ISAIAH PERTAIN TO US TODAY
All prophecies in Isaiah are prophecies of the last days.
Avraham Gileadi is THE authority on Isaiah and a good place to start is with his website -
http://www.isaiahexplained.com/
here is some more of Isaiah.
Did you realize that in the 29th chapter of Isaiah he describes the coming forth
of the original plates of the Book of Mormon and the attitude of the people against it.
taken from: LDS Seminary Student Study Guide
"Isaiah 29 is one place in the Bible where the Book of Mormon is referred to, even though it is not mentioned by name.
As you read this chapter, look for prophecies of the coming forth of the Book of Mormon and the impact this book will have on the world."
Now if the 29th Chapter of Isaiah refers to our people and nation,
then it is very feasible that the 28th chapter may also refer to us.
If you want a big wake up call please read it !
If you study this 28th chapter of Isaiah
it will reveal that every word applies to our church in these days
and to no other people.
Isaiah cites that this people would be given "precept upon precept;
precept upon precept; line upon line, line upon line; here a little and there a little."
These identical words, were used by the Prophet Joseph Smith among his closing instructions
to the latter day saints, warning us to go forward not backward. D.C.128:21-22 ; 2Nephi 28:30
Isaiah 28:13 "But the word of the Lord was unto them precept upon precept, precept upon precept;
line upon line, line upon line; here a little, and there a little;
that they might go, and fall backward, and be
broken, and snared, and taken."
We are still satisfied with the ABC portions of the gospel.
We will not accept the meat portions of the gospel.
Isaiah 28:
9 Whom shall he give instruction?
Whom shall he enlighten with revelation?
Weanlings weaned from milk,those just taken from the breast?
10 For it is but line upon line, line upon line,precept upon precept,
precept upon precept;a trifle here, a trifle there.
Isaiah28:1 "Woe to the crown of pride, to the drunkards of Ephraim, whose glorious beauty is a fading flower,
which are on the head of the fat valleys of them that are overcome with wine!"
Salt Lake City is a "fat valley" if I've ever seen one.
It is very sobering to wake up and find the sad condition we are in.
Try getting around this one.
DeleteQuestion - If the holy church spoken of in Mormon 8:38 is not our church, then what church is it ?
Mormon 8:35
"Behold, I speak unto you as if ye were present, and yet ye are not.
But behold, Jesus Christ hath shown you unto me, and I know your doing."
Mormon 8:38
38 O ye pollutions, ye hypocrites, ye teachers, who sell yourselves for that which will canker, why
(have ye polluted the holy church of God?) Why are
ye ashamed to take upon you the name of Christ? Why do ye not think that greater is the value of an endless happiness than that misery which never dies—because of the praise of the world?
Please read ALL of Mormon Chapter 8
Mormon 8:35
"Behold, I speak unto you as if ye were present, and yet ye are not.
But behold, Jesus Christ hath shown you unto me, and I know your doing."
Mormon is speaking to us today.
36 And I know that ye do walk in the pride of your hearts; and there are none save a few only who do not lift themselves up in the pride of their hearts, unto the wearing of very fine apparel, unto envying, and strifes, and malice, and persecutions, and all manner of iniquities; and your churches, yea, ( even every one ),
have become polluted because of the pride of your hearts.
37 For behold, ye do love money, and your substance, and your fine apparel, and the adorning of your churches, more than ye love the poor and the needy, the sick and the afflicted.
I think we need to look at verses 23 and 26
23 "even from the dust will they cry"
26 "for out of the earth shall they come"
"and it shall come even as if one should speak from the dead."
These verses sound like to me they are referring to
none other than the book these are in,
and the person who is speaking to us
who's it (the book) is named after,
the coming forth of the "The Book of Mormon".
And even if they are not; ALL the scriptures after that, verses 27 to the end are talking about the last days. our days NOW.
Someone made this comment some time ago.
Mormons today dwindle in unbelief. There is a pervasive belief among us that we are God's chosen people and therefore unavoidably in the right way. So when we read the BOM giving desperate warnings about the churches in the last days, we automatically assume those warnings apply to all churches but our own.
We tend to apply the most important lessons of the book to everyone else but ourselves. Its a great example of standing on the rameumptom. Read Alma Chapter 31. Its a story of who?... That's right... The Mormons.
You would think that it would be odd to the Mormons that so much effort was wasted warning those who will never read the book.
Elder L. Tom Perry
DeleteGeneral Conference Oct. 1992
Using Mormon Chapter 8 to teach us about pride and wealth.
https://www.lds.org/general-conference/1992/10/behold-the-lord-hath-shown-unto-me-great-and-marvelous-things?lang=eng
These are some quotes from his talk.
We sense that the only thing Moroni is living for is to complete the record, as he writes, “Therefore I will write and hide up the records in the earth; and whither I go it mattereth not.” (Morm. 8:4.)
All he has is the faith that the Lord will preserve him long enough to complete the record and that someday it will be found by one chosen of the Lord. He realizes that the record will be a voice of warning to future generations of what occurs when nations like his own turn away from the teachings of the Lord. It is from the depths of his heart that Moroni cries out to those who will eventually receive the record. He wants to spare those who read his account the heartache and misery which comes from disobedience.
He writes first to the members of the Church and then to those who have not embraced the gospel of Jesus Christ. Moroni’s last words to the members of the Church are written as a voice of warning. He writes as one who sees the history of his people repeating itself in the future. From the Book of Mormon we read:
“Behold, the Lord hath shown unto me great and marvelous things concerning that which must shortly come, at that day when these things shall come forth among you.
“Behold, I speak unto you as if ye were present, and yet ye are not. But behold, Jesus Christ hath shown you unto me, and I know your doing.
“And I know that ye do walk in the pride of your hearts; and there are none save a few only who do not lift themselves up in the pride of their hearts, unto the wearing of very fine apparel, unto envying, and strifes, and malice, and persecutions, and all manner of iniquities; and your churches, yea, even every one, have become polluted because of the pride of your hearts.
“For behold, ye do love money, and your substance, and your fine apparel, and the adorning of your churches, more than ye love the poor and the needy, the sick and the afflicted.
“O ye pollutions, ye hypocrites, ye teachers, who sell yourselves for that which will canker, why have ye polluted the holy church of God? Why are ye ashamed to take upon you the name of Christ? Why do ye not think that greater is the value of an endless happiness than that misery which never dies—because of the praise of the world?” (Morm. 8:34–38.)
I guess one of the greatest mysteries of mortality is why mankind fails to learn from history. Why do those who profess to be true followers of Christ so often become victims of the enticements of the world? The evidence is so strong regarding the blessings which accrue to those who trust in and follow the ways the Lord has prescribed for us.
"How I wish I could feel comfortable with all this special attention we are receiving. In the midst of this favorable publicity, we see so many members seeking worldly pursuits contrary to the words of the Lord’s prophets through the ages."
"Many of us are more concerned about our fine apparel, the size of our homes, and our cars and their gadgets than we are about the needs of the poor and the needy. We also have seen the threat of legalized abortion, gambling, pornography, and challenges to public prayer undermining the values that bind us together as a community of Saints."
"Clearly, the members of the Church face tremendous challenges in the latter days. We must not only resist, but mount a counteroffensive against the temptations of the world and its teachings, if we are to preserve our uniqueness."
What time period was Christ talking about in these scriptures below ?
DeleteMatthew 24
And Jesus went out, and departed from the temple: and his disciples came to him for to shew him the buildings of the temple.
2 And Jesus said unto them, See ye not all these things? verily I say unto you, There shall not be left here one stone upon another, that shall not be thrown down.
3 And as he sat upon the mount of Olives, the disciples came unto him privately, saying, Tell us, when shall these things be? and what shall be the sign of thy coming, and of the END OF THE WORLD?
4 And Jesus answered and said unto them, Take heed that no man deceive you.
5 For many shall come in my name, saying, I am Christ; and shall deceive many.
6 AND YE SHALL HEAR OF WARS AND RUMOURS OF WARS:
see that ye be not troubled: for all these things must come to pass,
BUT THE END IS NOT YET.
7 For nation shall rise against nation, and kingdom against kingdom: and there shall be famines, and pestilences, and earthquakes, in divers places.
8 All these are the beginning of sorrows.
Now doesn't verse 6 in Matthew 24
6 AND YE SHALL HEAR OF WARS AND RUMOURS OF WARS:
see that ye be not troubled: for all these things must come to pass,
BUT THE END IS NOT YET.
sound like this verse below ?:
Mormon 8:
30 And there shall also be HEARD OF WARS, RUMORS OF WARS, and earthquakes in divers places.
Many have speculated that Mormon was talking about a different time.
These scriptures are talking about the LAST DAYS - NOW !
NOT Joseph Smiths time or some other time in the past.
READ ! Mormon 8 verses 27 to the end.
They are talking about the last days. our days NOW.
continued
DeleteREAD !
27 And it shall come in a day when the blood of saints shall cry unto the Lord, because of secret combinations and the works of darkness.
28 Yea, it shall come in a day when the power of God shall be denied, and churches become defiled and be lifted up in the pride of their hearts; yea, even in a day when leaders of churches and teachers shall rise in the pride of their hearts, even to the envying of them who belong to their churches.
29 Yea, it shall come in a day when there shall be heard of fires, and tempests, and vapors of smoke in foreign lands;
30 And there shall also be heard of wars, rumors of wars, and earthquakes in divers places.
31 Yea, it shall come in a day when there shall be great pollutions upon the face of the earth; there shall be murders, and robbing, and lying, and deceivings, and whoredoms, and all manner of abominations; when there shall be many who will say, Do this, or do that, and it mattereth not, for the Lord will uphold such at the last day. But wo unto such, for they are in the gall of bitterness and in the bonds of iniquity.
32 Yea, it shall come in a day when there shall be churches built up that shall say: Come unto me, and for your money you shall be forgiven of your sins.
33 O ye wicked and perverse and stiffnecked people, why have ye built up churches unto yourselves to get gain? Why have ye transfigured the holy word of God, that ye might bring damnation upon your souls? Behold, look ye unto the revelations of God; for behold, the time cometh at that day when all these things must be fulfilled.
34 Behold, the Lord hath shown unto me great and marvelous things concerning that which must shortly come, at that day when these things shall come forth among you.
35 Behold, I speak unto you as if ye were present, and yet ye are not. But behold, Jesus Christ hath shown you unto me, and I know your doing.
36 And I know that ye do walk in the pride of your hearts; and there are none save a few only who do not lift themselves up in the pride of their hearts, unto the wearing of very fine apparel, unto envying, and strifes, and malice, and persecutions, and all manner of iniquities;
and your churches, yea, even every one, have become polluted because of the pride of your hearts.
37 For behold, ye do love money, and your substance, and your fine apparel, and the adorning of your churches, more than ye love the poor and the needy, the sick and the afflicted.[/b]
38 O ye pollutions, ye hypocrites, ye teachers, who sell yourselves for that which will canker,
why have ye polluted the holy church of God? Why are ye ashamed to take upon you the name of Christ? Why do ye not think that greater is the value of an endless happiness than that misery which never dies—because of the praise of the world?
39 Why do ye adorn yourselves with that which hath no life, and yet suffer the hungry, and the needy, and the naked, and the sick and the afflicted to pass by you, and notice them not?
40 Yea, why do ye build up your secret abominations to get gain, and cause that widows should mourn before the Lord, and also orphans to mourn before the Lord, and also the blood of their fathers and their husbands to cry unto the Lord from the ground, for vengeance upon your heads?
41 Behold, the sword of vengeance hangeth over you; and the time soon cometh that he avengeth the blood of the saints upon you, for he will not suffer their cries any longer.
OK my friend, I agree with much of what you say. I recognize that there are many members who are asleep, who have taken for granted the great blessings that have been given them. Many of us have become complacent, not seeking for the guidance of the Holy Spirit as we should. Many have taken for granted the Book of Mormon and the words of Isaiah. I myself often ask, "Lord is it I", and I think we all need to ask that question. I always go back to the parable of the ten virgins. All 10 virgins were invited to the marriage feast but 5 did not make it because they had run out of oil. We all need to make sure we have a good supply of oil which Elder Bednar says is the oil of conversion.
DeleteAll that being said, it does not mean that the church is in apostasy. That would mean that the church has lost its authority to act in the name of Jesus Christ. That certainly has not happened. Nor does it mean that the leaders of the church do not lead the church through revelation from Lord. It simply means that some or many of the member are not listening or obeying.
So now my friend I need to ask you a few questions. It is easy to misunderstand someone when you are are communicating on line. I need to know where you stand.
1) Do you recognize the Church of Jesus Christ of Latter Day Saints as the only true Church of Christ on the earth today?
2) Do you sustain Thomas S. Monson as a prophet, seer, and revelator of the Lord Jesus Christ?
3) Do you sustain the other Apostles as prophet, seers, and revelators?
My friend you have still not awakened from your deep sleep, and have NOT read what I have written because the scriptures have already answered your questions.
DeleteIt is the church and it's members that are in apostasy, and are included with the Gentiles in the judgements and tribulations that are coming upon them in this "choice" land - this fallen land of America.
Study your B of M and Isaiah closely.
The restored gospel is our church today.
3 Nephi 21:
22 But if they will repent and hearken unto my words, and harden not their hearts, I will establish my church among them, (our church today)
D&C 45:29 "BUT THEY RECEIVE IT NOT"
D&C 45:28-31
28 And when the times of the Gentiles is come in, a light shall break forth among them that sit in darkness, and it shall be the fulness of my gospel;
29 BUT THEY RECEIVE IT NOT;
for they perceive not the light, and they turn their hearts from me because of the precepts of men.
30 And in that generation shall the times of the Gentiles be fulfilled.
31 And there shall be men standing in that generation, that shall not pass until they shall see an overflowing scourge; for a desolating sickness shall cover the land."
There are so many scriptures that give us warnings but we don't listen. The warnings are for us (members), not the other guy like we think it is.
YES the gospel was restored. But that does NOT mean that we are immune to Apostasy, just as they
(the peoples of the BofM did, we also have done.
We were given their book as a warning to not make the same mistakes as they did, but we have.
Why as members do we always feel that
the sun revolves around us.
Just because we have the restored gospel.
That, just as the children of Abraham said:
"we are the children of Abraham that God
has covenanted with and that he would bless
his seed forever."
Us members say -
"We have the restored gospel and it will
never be taken from the earth again."
Matthew 3:9 (KJV)
9 And think not to say within yourselves,
We have Abraham to our father:
for I say unto you, that God is able
of these stones to raise up children unto Abraham.
It won't be taken from the earth again.
The Lord will take it FROM us.
We had our chance.
The gospel and the power and authority is now
going back to the House of Israel
"I will bring the fulness of my gospel from among them."
3 Nephi 16:10,11,12
10 And thus commandeth the Father that I should say unto you: At that day when the Gentiles shall sin against my gospel, and shall reject the fulness of my gospel, and shall be lifted up in the pride of their hearts above all nations, and above all the people of the whole earth, and shall be filled with all manner of lyings, and of deceits, and of mischiefs, and all manner of hypocrisy, and murders, and priestcrafts, and whoredoms, and of secret abominations; and if they shall do all those things, and shall reject the fulness of my gospel, behold, saith the Father,
I will bring the fulness of my gospel from among them.
11 And then will I remember my covenant which I have made unto my people, O house of Israel, and I will bring my gospel unto them.
12 And I will show unto thee, O house of Israel, that the Gentiles shall not have power over you; but I will remember my covenant unto you, O house of Israel, and ye shall come unto the knowledge of the fulness of my gospel.
Isaiah 49:3 1 Nephi 21:3
3 And said unto me, Thou art my servant,
O Israel, in whom I will be glorified.
continued
ReplyDeleteOrson Pratt's works
NEW JERUSALEM
"Let the bishop read this to the elders, that they may warn the members of the
scourge that is coming, except they repent. Tell them to read the Book of Mormon
and obey it ; read the commandments that are printed and obey them : yea, humble
yourselves under the mighty hand of God, that peradventure he may turn away his
anger from you. Tell them that they have not come up to Zion to sit down in idleness,
neglecting the things of God, but they are to be diligent and faithful in obeying
the new covenant.
There is one clause in Brother Joseph's letter which you may not understand
that is this,
" if the people of Zion did not repent, the Lord would seek another place
and another people." Zion is the place where the temple will be built, and the people
gathered, but all people upon that holy land being under condemnation, the Lord
will cut off if they repent not, and bring another race upon it that will serve him.
The Lord will seek another place to bring forth and prepare bis word to go forth to
the nations, and as we said before so say we again, Brother Joseph will not settle in
Zion, except she repent and serve God, and obey the new covenant. With this explanation
the conference sanctions Brother Joseph's letter."